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#91
Boot Managers / There is Zero documentation
Last post by Grunchy - December 03, 2021, 15:16:51 PMSo there can be HDA through HDD, which corresponds to four hard disks.
For each there are up to four partitions eg. HDA1, HDA2, HDA3, and HDA4.
Each partition can be: Don't Touch, Clear, Logical, some specific other partition, and up to one can be marked "Boot."
I've been trying to make heads or tails of what this all means, it kind of depresses me that nobody ever thought to take a moment to explain what that all means or how you can use it to set up a multi boot.
Let's take this simple scenario: suppose I create a profile and for HDA I assign the partitions HDA2, HDA1, Don't Touch, and Don't Touch. What does Plop do when I boot this profile? I can't get anything except for a flashing cursor, or "no boot disk" error, or some other error. For example if I set up a profile HDA1 boot, Clear, Clear, and Clear, it's liable to boot Windows XP in the second partition. What about Windows 98 in the first partition?
And does any of this have anything to do with "active" partition?
I feel like I'm taking stabs in the dark to try to figure out what any of this could possibly mean, except each 'stab' is another hour installing another OS off CD-rom just to try to find another clue, and why the H can't anybody take 5 minutes to explain what it means to set up a boot profile??
For each there are up to four partitions eg. HDA1, HDA2, HDA3, and HDA4.
Each partition can be: Don't Touch, Clear, Logical, some specific other partition, and up to one can be marked "Boot."
I've been trying to make heads or tails of what this all means, it kind of depresses me that nobody ever thought to take a moment to explain what that all means or how you can use it to set up a multi boot.
Let's take this simple scenario: suppose I create a profile and for HDA I assign the partitions HDA2, HDA1, Don't Touch, and Don't Touch. What does Plop do when I boot this profile? I can't get anything except for a flashing cursor, or "no boot disk" error, or some other error. For example if I set up a profile HDA1 boot, Clear, Clear, and Clear, it's liable to boot Windows XP in the second partition. What about Windows 98 in the first partition?
And does any of this have anything to do with "active" partition?
I feel like I'm taking stabs in the dark to try to figure out what any of this could possibly mean, except each 'stab' is another hour installing another OS off CD-rom just to try to find another clue, and why the H can't anybody take 5 minutes to explain what it means to set up a boot profile??
#92
Boot Managers / Re: How to install Plop Boot M...
Last post by Elmar - November 04, 2021, 18:09:58 PMYour Linux is started by a boot manager. Mostly its Grub. You can add the Plop Boot Manager as additional boot option to the boot menu.
https://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/plpbt.bin.html#rungrub
Note: There is a difference betwee Grub and Grub2.
https://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager/plpbt.bin.html#rungrub
Note: There is a difference betwee Grub and Grub2.
#93
Boot Managers / How to install Plop Boot Manag...
Last post by jcalbinana - November 03, 2021, 18:03:45 PMI would like to install the Plop Boot Manager 5 on a very old computer without USB BIOS compatibility.
The computer has a linux installed but I do not understandt how to install it
The computer has a linux installed but I do not understandt how to install it
#94
Boot Managers / Re: himem.sys ERROR: Unable to...
Last post by qiet72 - October 27, 2021, 10:07:01 AMDid some more testing. The himem.sys error occurs when booting on a Thinkpad T60p.
When testing under Qemu - the error is does not come up.
Maybe Plop has problems releasing control of the A20 line before booting the OS on Thinkpads??
Qiet72
When testing under Qemu - the error is does not come up.
Maybe Plop has problems releasing control of the A20 line before booting the OS on Thinkpads??
Qiet72
#95
Boot Managers / Re: himem.sys ERROR: Unable to...
Last post by qiet72 - October 26, 2021, 19:51:26 PMHi,
I know this topic is old but I am seeing the same error in the latest version of plopt (5.0.15). Have tried floppy > plpbt.bin > usb drive > dos 6.2.2.
If I look back in history in the changelogs, it looks like was fixed in 5.0.11 but that version is not available anymore for testing.
It is possible to repost 5.0.11 for testing?
qiet72
I know this topic is old but I am seeing the same error in the latest version of plopt (5.0.15). Have tried floppy > plpbt.bin > usb drive > dos 6.2.2.
If I look back in history in the changelogs, it looks like was fixed in 5.0.11 but that version is not available anymore for testing.
It is possible to repost 5.0.11 for testing?
qiet72
#96
Boot Managers / InstallToBootMenu - boot menu ...
Last post by oldboot - October 19, 2021, 15:04:27 PMError trying to get working the install to Windows boot menu on IBM ThinkCentre S50 Type 8183-21G
Using the current "plpbt-5.0.15.zip"
Existing SSD environment: Windows 7 Professional SP1 i386 / w32
Used batch file "InstallToBootMenu.bat" without changing anything to install to Windows boot menu (NOT to MBR) but after reboot and on selecting its entry (appearing in Windows boot menu after local hdd) a black screen appears after approx. a second's delay with "Press any key to reboot...", which just cycles back to Windows boot menu and so ad inf..
Evidently no issues with BIOS or the SSD being used because if I deploy in floppy drive a: the plpbt.bin (NOT the install version fdd) it brings up the (space invaders-reminiscent) green lettering of plop and that enables select of USB which when chosen finds usb stick and from which I have booted live i386/w32 "cdroms" of Debian LXQt and MX Linux.
The ran "plpcfgbtGUI.exe" as Admin and its screen is all greyed out except for plpbt.bin in box 'Boot Manager File' at top. Clicking the Open box gets error "Boot manager file not found".
"plpbt.bin" is in default location as per install.
Selecting the Open dialogue appearing next to its displayed name enables immediate selection of "plpbt.bin" and then rest is not greyed out. NB on opening default plop directory of c:\plop there are:
plpbt.bin
plpbt4win.exe
plpbt4win.ldr
"plpcfgbtGUI.exe"
- at bottom of its screen appears: 0.3 20110730
- at top of its screen it refers to "plpcfgbt.exe version 0.11 20120203 found. Version Error"
Any ideas how to fix so when I select plopbm in windows boot menu it brings up plopbm with its green lettering like with fdd so I can choose USB and boot from USB stick in the way that was successful using floppy created with plopbm fdd image?
Using the current "plpbt-5.0.15.zip"
Existing SSD environment: Windows 7 Professional SP1 i386 / w32
Used batch file "InstallToBootMenu.bat" without changing anything to install to Windows boot menu (NOT to MBR) but after reboot and on selecting its entry (appearing in Windows boot menu after local hdd) a black screen appears after approx. a second's delay with "Press any key to reboot...", which just cycles back to Windows boot menu and so ad inf..
Evidently no issues with BIOS or the SSD being used because if I deploy in floppy drive a: the plpbt.bin (NOT the install version fdd) it brings up the (space invaders-reminiscent) green lettering of plop and that enables select of USB which when chosen finds usb stick and from which I have booted live i386/w32 "cdroms" of Debian LXQt and MX Linux.
The ran "plpcfgbtGUI.exe" as Admin and its screen is all greyed out except for plpbt.bin in box 'Boot Manager File' at top. Clicking the Open box gets error "Boot manager file not found".
"plpbt.bin" is in default location as per install.
Selecting the Open dialogue appearing next to its displayed name enables immediate selection of "plpbt.bin" and then rest is not greyed out. NB on opening default plop directory of c:\plop there are:
plpbt.bin
plpbt4win.exe
plpbt4win.ldr
"plpcfgbtGUI.exe"
- at bottom of its screen appears: 0.3 20110730
- at top of its screen it refers to "plpcfgbt.exe version 0.11 20120203 found. Version Error"
Any ideas how to fix so when I select plopbm in windows boot menu it brings up plopbm with its green lettering like with fdd so I can choose USB and boot from USB stick in the way that was successful using floppy created with plopbm fdd image?
#97
Boot Managers / Re: PBM6 - Chainloading von Gr...
Last post by Dodobird - September 30, 2021, 12:40:32 PMServus Elmar,
vielen dank für die Antwort.
menuentry "Plop Bootmanager 6" {
insmod chain
chainloader /Extras/pbm6-x64.efi
}
Das hat jetzt noch nicht funktioniert. Ist insgesamt nicht weiter tragisch, da PBM6 vor allem im BIOS-Modus bzw. auf älteren Mainboards/Laptops seine Nützlichkeit ausspielt.
Hier eben die Beschreibung, was nicht funktioniert.
TianoCore EFI: Reboot ohne weitere Fehlermeldung.
Dell 6310, EFI-Modus: Hängt ohne weitere Fehlermeldung in Grub2.
vielen dank für die Antwort.
menuentry "Plop Bootmanager 6" {
insmod chain
chainloader /Extras/pbm6-x64.efi
}
Das hat jetzt noch nicht funktioniert. Ist insgesamt nicht weiter tragisch, da PBM6 vor allem im BIOS-Modus bzw. auf älteren Mainboards/Laptops seine Nützlichkeit ausspielt.
Hier eben die Beschreibung, was nicht funktioniert.
TianoCore EFI: Reboot ohne weitere Fehlermeldung.
Dell 6310, EFI-Modus: Hängt ohne weitere Fehlermeldung in Grub2.
#98
Boot Managers / Re: PBM6 - Chainloading von Gr...
Last post by Elmar - September 23, 2021, 13:14:17 PMHallo,
so sollte es funktionieren
LG
Elmar
so sollte es funktionieren
Code Select
menuentry "Plop Bootmanager 6" {
insmod chain
chainloader /Extras/pbm6-x64.efi
}
LG
Elmar
#99
Boot Managers / PBM6 - Chainloading von Grub 2...
Last post by Dodobird - September 23, 2021, 11:55:11 AMHallo und Gruezi,
ich möchte PBM6 aus Grub2 im EFI-Modus starten. Bisher habe ich ein paar Ansätze ausprobiert, und im BIOS-Modus funktioniert der Boot einwandfrei. Im EFI-Modus habe ich soweit noch keinen Erfolg. Ich versuche, die efi-Datei per chainloader aufzurufen, was beispielsweise mit der Super Grub Disk 2 funktioniert:
menuentry " Plop Bootmanager 6" {
insmod chain
chainloader /Extras/pbm6-efi.iso
}
Auf einer Tianocore-Referenzimplementierung unter KVM führt dieser Aufruf zu einem Neustart. Auf realer Hardware geht nichts weiter.
Irgendwelche Ideen, was ich noch probieren könnte?
Best,
David
ich möchte PBM6 aus Grub2 im EFI-Modus starten. Bisher habe ich ein paar Ansätze ausprobiert, und im BIOS-Modus funktioniert der Boot einwandfrei. Im EFI-Modus habe ich soweit noch keinen Erfolg. Ich versuche, die efi-Datei per chainloader aufzurufen, was beispielsweise mit der Super Grub Disk 2 funktioniert:
menuentry " Plop Bootmanager 6" {
insmod chain
chainloader /Extras/pbm6-efi.iso
}
Auf einer Tianocore-Referenzimplementierung unter KVM führt dieser Aufruf zu einem Neustart. Auf realer Hardware geht nichts weiter.
Irgendwelche Ideen, was ich noch probieren könnte?
Best,
David
#100
Boot Managers / Re: Would PLoP support VHD-fil...
Last post by volume - September 13, 2021, 16:27:25 PMif plpvhd will have some more flexible options many people from
reboot.pro, msfn.org or vogons and other old-school(os2musem) will happily use plpvhd.
Many retro gaming users or legacy industry administrators are need it.
Not all aplications are running under virtual machines or API emulators in PM-mode/DPMI Extender.
They need true "Real mode" and Realtime OS without tasks schedullers.
Look on 1th example - from life...
If you are small metalworker and you have old FANUC CNC Lathe which has only DOS16/realmode program for it from 1980's
Which need direct access to LPTport for controlling servos/ board like Mach3 SW.
You have only few options:
a) Vboot (comercial)
b) Chinese bootloaders (will you use it?) me not.
c) BOOTMGR (complicated bcdedit) impossible remember UUIDs and config!
d) plpvhd tiny simple out of box loader
Machine operators are old people they don't like new windows systems and learn new programs.
2nd scenario:
You have dos program and old LPT ZIPdrive and ELCOM EEPROM programmer
and you need use it 2-3times per year and you don't want kick it to trash. So simple boot freeddos.vhd make EEPROM copies and return to your primary OS. only simple reboot needed
Flashing SW for Nokias playing.
I helped to one man who is repairring eletronics he has copy of EEPROMs for many many devices car radio or PLC.
Many industry based systems SIEMENS/SIMATICs are still running on very old HW.
Also in automotive (VW really I saw it!), fabrication or in BANK/finnance sector are using OS2/Warp or OS2/Aurora and COBOL based interbanking exchange systems! AS/400 and other obscure legacy systems.
My last experience:
I have problem with HDD last month and i have there WinXP in VHD
i was able boot WinXP and recover primary OS Win7 partition after HW fail
this old machine has no USB boot support only FDD/ATAPI or HDD
and also crippled BIOS boot from ATAPI is not able boot Win7/VIsta bootloader from DVD!
I have to use workaround like mcGyver....
CDROM boot (isolinux) -> Grub4Dos (very flexible) with shell
find on disk PloP and enable USB 2.0 support and boot from USB dongle
where was Win7 installer.
And this way i found plpvhd ...
I dediced try it vs. BOOTMGR (win7 boot manager).
BOotMGR has binary \BOOT\bcd config and edit require working OS with bcdedit.exe.
Thats in recovery/emergency situations really ODD/sux....
It's much better boot GRUB4DOS 0.4.6c (much better than v0.4.5)
such like non-casesensitive paths, autocomplette on TAB key etc...
quite powerfull shell
And this is the reason why will be fine has option tell to plpvhd
load me please DISK_D\VHDIMG\freedos.vhd or C:\RESCUE.VHD\winxp.vhd
Windows bootloader has this - hidden feature implemented such like this
http://reboot.pro/topic/7502-windows-recovery-console-in-grub4dos/
It's writting on fixed memory location special string.
plpvhd.bin may check "PLPVHD" signature at memory location
it's only (6bytes) 3x times cmp ax, value if is not present bootloader will go in interactive mode (manual filelisting)
If special string exist it will try get next parameters such like partition and filename.
This is same as APPEND in isolinux parameters for kernel
and this is giving big flexibility.
I want only describe what people are missing and how to implement
easy with big step forward with minimal attack on source code.
Why this parameters are GOOD to HAVE? you may prepare simple
boot menu from GRUB/GRUB4DOS/GRUB2 and make booting easier
also for kids which may play old DOS games without waitting on Father
which will start OS + GAME
btw GRUB has failover features if boot fail it will activate alternative commands machine will load another VHDfile...
(important on production machines such like CNC Lathe Computer)
But adding choose another partition and filter deleted files is fine.
I am happy now probably later you will add parameters during COVID lockdown
reboot.pro, msfn.org or vogons and other old-school(os2musem) will happily use plpvhd.
Many retro gaming users or legacy industry administrators are need it.
Not all aplications are running under virtual machines or API emulators in PM-mode/DPMI Extender.
They need true "Real mode" and Realtime OS without tasks schedullers.
Look on 1th example - from life...
If you are small metalworker and you have old FANUC CNC Lathe which has only DOS16/realmode program for it from 1980's
Which need direct access to LPTport for controlling servos/ board like Mach3 SW.
You have only few options:
a) Vboot (comercial)
b) Chinese bootloaders (will you use it?) me not.
c) BOOTMGR (complicated bcdedit) impossible remember UUIDs and config!
d) plpvhd tiny simple out of box loader
Machine operators are old people they don't like new windows systems and learn new programs.
2nd scenario:
You have dos program and old LPT ZIPdrive and ELCOM EEPROM programmer
and you need use it 2-3times per year and you don't want kick it to trash. So simple boot freeddos.vhd make EEPROM copies and return to your primary OS. only simple reboot needed
Flashing SW for Nokias playing.
I helped to one man who is repairring eletronics he has copy of EEPROMs for many many devices car radio or PLC.
Many industry based systems SIEMENS/SIMATICs are still running on very old HW.
Also in automotive (VW really I saw it!), fabrication or in BANK/finnance sector are using OS2/Warp or OS2/Aurora and COBOL based interbanking exchange systems! AS/400 and other obscure legacy systems.
My last experience:
I have problem with HDD last month and i have there WinXP in VHD
i was able boot WinXP and recover primary OS Win7 partition after HW fail
this old machine has no USB boot support only FDD/ATAPI or HDD
and also crippled BIOS boot from ATAPI is not able boot Win7/VIsta bootloader from DVD!
I have to use workaround like mcGyver....
CDROM boot (isolinux) -> Grub4Dos (very flexible) with shell
find on disk PloP and enable USB 2.0 support and boot from USB dongle
where was Win7 installer.
And this way i found plpvhd ...
I dediced try it vs. BOOTMGR (win7 boot manager).
BOotMGR has binary \BOOT\bcd config and edit require working OS with bcdedit.exe.
Thats in recovery/emergency situations really ODD/sux....
It's much better boot GRUB4DOS 0.4.6c (much better than v0.4.5)
such like non-casesensitive paths, autocomplette on TAB key etc...
quite powerfull shell
And this is the reason why will be fine has option tell to plpvhd
load me please DISK_D\VHDIMG\freedos.vhd or C:\RESCUE.VHD\winxp.vhd
Windows bootloader has this - hidden feature implemented such like this
http://reboot.pro/topic/7502-windows-recovery-console-in-grub4dos/
It's writting on fixed memory location special string.
plpvhd.bin may check "PLPVHD" signature at memory location
it's only (6bytes) 3x times cmp ax, value if is not present bootloader will go in interactive mode (manual filelisting)
If special string exist it will try get next parameters such like partition and filename.
This is same as APPEND in isolinux parameters for kernel
and this is giving big flexibility.
I want only describe what people are missing and how to implement
easy with big step forward with minimal attack on source code.
Why this parameters are GOOD to HAVE? you may prepare simple
boot menu from GRUB/GRUB4DOS/GRUB2 and make booting easier
also for kids which may play old DOS games without waitting on Father
which will start OS + GAME
btw GRUB has failover features if boot fail it will activate alternative commands machine will load another VHDfile...
(important on production machines such like CNC Lathe Computer)
But adding choose another partition and filter deleted files is fine.
I am happy now probably later you will add parameters during COVID lockdown